| Press for Fall of 1910 in ghodstoo |
Movement
Private message from England to Turkey:
I do hope you plan on taking Cal out before we call this thing?
Jamie
Private message from England to France:
Whew. You were right, Pitt was merely not paying close attention.
Now everything is looking pretty tight, defensively speaking.
I bet Hohn will try to squish the German A Sil. If you want to keep Pitt
around, let him retreat to Ber; but if you don't think there's any more use
for him, this would be the time to go for it. I'm sure you see what I mean.
GKJ
Private message from Italy to Turkey:
Well that turn went well enough. John seemed to make the "threatening"
yet non-dangerous moves he said he would. I still think he'll have to
get Jamie to take Pitt out first. Any more word from the "Gentle King"?
Here's some suggested moves for you to ponder:
Italy
~~~~~~
f naf-tun
f apu-ion
a rom-tus
a ven s a tyo-pie
These satisfy my prerogatives of staying near home as well as getting
you into position to make and hold the stalemate line.
Turkey
~~~~~~~
f wes-naf
f tyn-wes, s by f lyo
f ion-tyn
f adr h
a bul-rum
a mos & a ukr s a war
a gal-sil, s by a war & a boh
a tyo-pie
a vie-tyo, s by a tri
These moves strengthen our line and increase MY security (but without
becoming any threat to you as you will have virtually penetrated any
defensive lines I could throw up). Fair enough?
Thoughts?
Cal
Private message from England to France:
John,
I've analyzed the situation a bit. Here are the basics, first.
---part one---
I think you have to move MAO-Por. Because you'll need to defend Spa with it
as soon as Turkey knocks your army out of Piedmont.
You have to have Eng S Bre-MAO (or vice versa), and it probably won't go
because GoL-Spa, Naf S Wes-MAO. (But maybe Italy won't give that support?
Maybe he'll go cover Tunis again?) But that's ok, that part of the
stalemate line will be secure anyway. At some point either you'll have
another support for Spa, or I'll get a fleet over to get you into MAO, or
something. But it's secure.
The problem is going to be getting enough land support in place to secure
both Mar and Mun, and also we'll have to secure Berlin. So suppose Turkey
has A Pie, F GoL, A Tyo, Boh, Sil, Pru, eventually. (I don't think we can
prevent this in the long run unless I get a F Bal to support A Pru, and if
I do get that we don't need A Pru anyway.) Then there has to be a support
for Ber, two for Mun, and one for Mar.
At the moment, you've got the A Bur and the A Kie, but that's two short,
even assuming an army of yours or Pitt's sits in Berlin. You'll build this
winter and Par-Gas adds support for Mar, freeing A Bur for Mun. Still, the
A Kie can't support both Mun and Ber.
So either you'll have to have another army in Ruhr, or I'll have to have a
fleet Bal to do the extra work.
---part two---
Ok, so that should all be possible. Then the question is, will we keep
Germany around for the draw? You haven't said anything about this, but I
guess I'd want a 3-way draw if it's safe.
As far as I can tell, it is *NOT* safe to try to eliminate him now. My
first impression was that it would be safe, but I now think we cannot
secure all those soft spots and also finish him off. (You have enough
armies, but a couple of them are sticking out in ultimately unsupportable
places. Well, really just A Pie, if that were in Ruhr right now everything
would be ok.) For instance, if you ordered Pru-Ber, keeping him out of
there, and I took Sweden (from Bot), then we'd have him down to one unit,
but I think Turkey would (or could, with some lucky guessing) reach the
surrounding position quite rapidly, and I don't think I could get a F Bal
in time and also prevent Turkey from taking Stp.
Maybe I could. Probably. I'd manage it unless Turkey made very aggressive
moves this coming round. But it's quite a risk, I don't think it makes
sense to take it. Because in the end, I predict, Hohn would back off a
notch and let us eliminate Pitt later anyway, if we wanted to do it.
My recommendation, then, is to play it rather conservatively, with you
ordering MAO-Por and Eng S Bre-MAO, Bur S Mun, Mar S Spa, and maybe
Pru-Sil, Mun S Pru-Sil, Pie-Tyo. And I think I'll order Nth-Den, Bot-Swe,
so I'll be ready to enter Baltic and also have F Nwy, F Fin. Then when you
build A Par and go to Gas, we'll be completely safe.
Look it over, see what you think.
GKJ
Private message from France to England:
I printed out your message and will set up the board this afternoon. Sorry
for not responding sooner.
Private message from England to France:
So?
GKJ
Private message from Italy to Italy:
test
Private message from Turkey to Italy:
Cal,
Sorry, things have been insane around here. This is my first (and
only) press letter this turn.
I don't have time for a full analysis, so I'll trust that your moves
are good. If I make any changes, they won't be ones that will affect
you or your moves. Luck to us!
Hohn
Private message from Master to Turkey:
Well, we're sailing along through the "endgame" here. I just want
to remind everyone that your "press to m" about how you think your
chances are changing through this period are well-appreciated.
Jim
Private message from Turkey to Master:
Jim,
This is an example of "setting up an excuse" many years in advance.
It's true, I've been very busy. But I am never too busy to conduct a
quick five-minute full analysis of the board. I'm hoping my constant
(albeit true) whining about my lack of time will allay any fears Cal
has, because I'm considering stabbing him this turn. I'll make my
decision tonight when I get home and can access my board.
The problem has never been lack of time for an analysis, incidentally.
The problem has been forgetting about the deadline until it passes,
and/or being forced to negotiate in "waves," then intending to check
negotiation mail right before deadline, but inadvertently spacing out
on that intention. If I see a late notice, I immediately conduct my
tactical analysis and send moves in. (And as you know, I don't
negotiate _past_ deadline.)
Hohn
Private message from Master to Turkey:
>
> Message from [email protected] as Turkey to Master in 'ghodstoo':
>
> Jim,
>
> This is an example of "setting up an excuse" many years in advance.
>
Indeed, interestingly enough, I sent my previous message BEFORE getting
this one, but "feeling it in the wind". This is no indication that
_Cal_ knows that you might be about to stab, but at least that _I_
saw that you might be about to stab.
> It's true, I've been very busy. But I am never too busy to conduct a
> quick five-minute full analysis of the board. I'm hoping my constant
> (albeit true) whining about my lack of time will allay any fears Cal
> has, because I'm considering stabbing him this turn. I'll make my
> decision tonight when I get home and can access my board.
>
As it should be. The GM, of course, takes a completely agnostic
position on all such things.
> The problem has never been lack of time for an analysis, incidentally.
> The problem has been forgetting about the deadline until it passes,
> and/or being forced to negotiate in "waves," then intending to check
> negotiation mail right before deadline, but inadvertently spacing out
> on that intention. If I see a late notice, I immediately conduct my
> tactical analysis and send moves in. (And as you know, I don't
> negotiate _past_ deadline.)
>
> Hohn
>
Yes, I understand exactly what has been happening.
Jim
Private message from England to France:
So, if there's anything you'd like to tell me, this would be the time.
Gentle King Jamie
Private message from England to Germany:
Did you get my reply to your note? In short it asked what you meant by
really wanting to get a build this year, given that you cannot build this
year (because you don't own any home centers).
If you just hadn't thought it through carefully, I would like to take
Sweden, since I *can* build. But if I have failed to get your point or
something, I will certainly not take Sweden against your will.
GKJ
Private message from Italy to Turkey:
> Message from [email protected] as Turkey to Italy in 'ghodstoo':
> Sorry, things have been insane around here. This is my first (and
> only) press letter this turn.
>
> I don't have time for a full analysis, so I'll trust that your moves
> are good. If I make any changes, they won't be ones that will affect
> you or your moves. Luck to us!
Or you could always proxy all your units to me... evil grin. ;)
Cal
Private message from England to France:
I'm just going to take Sweden. I wrote to Pitt twice, pointing out that he
has no home center to build in. If he had written back with more
explanation/insistence, I would have stayed out of Swe, but since he never
said a word I'm taking it. I think I have a good move, you'll see.
>Why not take StP instead of Swe? All he could do is
>retreat to Fin and then disband one. If you
>moved to Den as well, he'd be out next turn.
Hm, but he could use A Fin to get Turkey into Stp. Maybe I could still get
Turkey out before he wiped out Italy for the win, but maybe not.
I bet the move doesn't process tonight.
GKJ
Private message from France to England:
I've gone with your conservative strategy. However, I don't think we dealt
with Pitt's insistence on gaining a build. He does not own a home center
anyway, so perhaps it's moot.
If you are still checking in, I have a question. Why not take StP instead
of Swe? All he could do is retreat to Fin and then disband one. If you
moved to Den as well, he'd be out next turn.
Maybe if Turkey did get close to 18, Italy would finally switch over.
Private message from England to France:
>Maybe if Turkey did get close to 18, Italy would finally switch over.
Well, we'll see now, huh? :-)
I haven't figured out whether those Turkish moves were good for us or bad.
Good, I think.
It's a good think I didn't use my fleet to go take Lvp, huh? You definitely
need all the units you have.
We have some time now, awaiting Italy's retreat. I might build an army,
intending to put it into your stalemate line. Might be kind of tricky,
logistically -- I was thinking an army in Ruhr would finish the job. And I
was expecting you would get a build because the A Pie would be destroyed,
but Hohn had other ideas....
It will be interesting to see whether Pitt thinks he's been stabbed by my
move. I think we might be ok even without him, though. I'll work it all out
later today.
GKJ
> Broadcast message from [email protected] as England in 'ghodstoo':
>
> >My apologies for being late by a few hours, everyone.
>
> It was worth waiting for, Hohn.
>
> Gentle King Jamie
This is a POV thing, no?
Cal
>My apologies for being late by a few hours, everyone.
It was worth waiting for, Hohn.
Gentle King Jamie
Private message from Turkey to Germany:
Pitt,
No offense, but, well, it doesn't look like you're long for this
world. You know it, I know it, they know it. STP is Jamie's whenever
he wants, without fear of any chance of me taking it, because he'll
have three on my two. Berlin is John's whenever he wants it as well,
because I won't be venturing past my stalemate line, so John will have
the leeway to take BER.
As you know, I've never betrayed you. Not once. However, I suspect
Jamie has, at least once. And I _know_ that John has, several times
in fact. Remember how much it _sucked_ when he nailed you that one
turn, right when it was starting to look like an FGT three-way?
If you're going to go down, why not play spoiler and try to help me
win? I'd really, really appreciate it. :) And I'll bet it would stick
in John's craw something fierce. ;)
Now, I'm sure John and Jamie might promise you the world not to give
me the throw-game-leverage (and your giving it to me would be their
fault anyway, particularly John's, for his several brutal stabs of
you, on multiple occasions), but really, how could you believe them?
With me staying behind my stalemate line, they can axe you in one
coordinated season, whenever they want. And unless you believe that
two expert, cutthroat players will increase the size of the draw out
of the goodness of your heart, well, you're more of a Diplomacy
optimist than I am, certainly. ;)
If you're willing, please let me know, and move STP-FIN in Spring. If
you're not willing, I understand, and there are of course no hard
feelings. I just thought I'd float the idea.
Hohn
Private message from Turkey to France:
John,
Interested in that two-way? I'll hang back wherever you want me to,
if you want to go for it.
Hohn
Private message from Turkey to Master:
Jim,
I am pleased.
I now see practically no way I can do any worse than a 17 center
three-way, assuming John and Jamie are rational.
I foresee a 15 unit stalemate line:
Fleets in: TUN, ION, TYS, TUS, ROM, NAP
Armies in: VEN, TYR, VIE, BOH, GAL, WAR, MOS, UKR, SEV
And two units to screw around with.
I sincerely doubt I will do any better than a three-way, but at least
I can say I, and not John, had the most centers at the end of the
game. If he even ever _did_ decide to stab, which appears uncertain
at this point, and if he never stabbed, then we were looking at a
solid four-way EFIT, so that's another good reason for the stab.
And who knows? Maybe I can pull off a miracle and take a win. I
doubt John will be suckered into a two-way.
Hohn
Private message from Turkey to Italy:
Cal,
I'm really, really sorry. I just saw the opportunity and I had to
take it, simply because:
1) It was a golden opportunity (I mean, three centers, you have to
admit that's a pretty solid stab);
1) I wasn't sure John was ever going to stab; and
2) As a cutthroat player, I'm always hoping for the win, no matter how
unlikely it looks, and the only way I can get anywhere near a win is
if I can grab more centers.
I'm sure you know it's nothing personal, but I just wanted to say it
anyway. I truly did enjoy working with you; my opportunism just got
the better of me.
Hohn
My apologies for being late by a few hours, everyone. I spent _much_
longer than I wish I had at work today.
Hohn
Retreats
Private message from Italy to Turkey:
> Message from [email protected] as Turkey to Italy in 'ghodstoo':
> I'm really, really sorry.
This is the one part of your letter I don't believe... :)
> I just saw the opportunity and I had to
> take it, simply because:
>
> 1) It was a golden opportunity (I mean, three centers, you have to
> admit that's a pretty solid stab);
> 1) I wasn't sure John was ever going to stab; and
> 2) As a cutthroat player, I'm always hoping for the win, no matter how
> unlikely it looks, and the only way I can get anywhere near a win is
> if I can grab more centers.
>
> I'm sure you know it's nothing personal, but I just wanted to say it
> anyway. I truly did enjoy working with you; my opportunism just got
> the better of me.
I'm not mad you stabbed (again), just surprised it took so long.
Actually, not even that, your timing was good. I do however
suspect that all you've done is give Jamie MY place in the draw.
Ah well, letting you stab me a THIRD time means I no longer deserved
that anyway.
For the record, if I'd gotten into the Ion, I was headed for Aegean
next turn. I wouldn't have taken any centres (unless you had breached
the stalemate line, but I would have kept MY hold on a piece of the
draw by maintain a grip on your proverbial short hairs. Ah well, I
should've known you couldn't let me go for it.
Take care and good luck. Now I can concentrate on the CDO stuff I've
started doing.
Cal
Private message from England to Germany:
The position is now pretty clear. If our alliance holds, we have it locked
up, and we'll have a four way draw. If anybody defects, Hohn wins. By
making his move now, Hohn has made us all 100% dependent on each other.
Pitt and I each have our own power over both Berlin and Stp, either one of
which is enough to give Turkey the win. I have no illusions about Pitt's
willingness to exercise that power, and I hope no one else has any about me.
Hohn has given France the opportunity to bring his wayward A Pied back
where it is of some use. I highly recommend seizing this opportunity. Since
John has no build, he can't protect Mar except by tying up the A Bur, which
he'll need for the protection of Munich. The solution should be obvious.
As for me, I will most assuredly order my two fleets to support Pitt's two
to hold, forevermore.
My F Swe is free to do anything useful, but it has nothing useful to do. (I
guess putting it in GoB is the sensible thing, but if Pitt wants me to I'll
move it to Denmark.)
I am cancelling my earlier hopeful plan to retake Liverpool, since John
cannot afford to give up another unit. Hm, actually, the one in Prussia is
an extra. Still, I won't take Liverpool. I don't need it for anything.
Pitt, within the range of non-suicidal moves, I'll do anything you want me
to do, since you are the one of us most likely (and reasonably) to have
qualms about his own security. Tell me what position you'd like to see, or
where you want me to go.
Gentle King Jamie
Private message from England to France:
I think I have a good plan now.
Since Turkey has A Mos, A Lvn, Germany has to have his army hold in Stp. I
will order Swe-Fin.
I can have my F Bal support you Pru-Ber.
You can order Mar-Gas, Pie-Mar, Bur S Pie-Mar.
If Germany turns this very move, I think Turkey wins. By Stp-Fin, he can
fork over Stp, and Hohn can hold it in the Fall, and Hohn will get Tunis
too and lose nothing.
If Germany doesn't turn, we'll have a locked up position. As follows:
Around Stp, I can just keep ordering Nwy S Fin-Stp. Eventually I can sail
in the other fleets for the elimination. My supported attack prevents
Turkey from ever taking Stp.
At the German front, you'll be able to order Kie S Mun, Bur S Mun, and I'll
add Bal S Ber. This holds against any attack.
Mar is held by Gas S Mar. And Spain by Por S Spa. And Eng S MAO finishes
the stalemate line.
What do you think? Are you ready to consecrate a three-way draw? Or do you
want to see if there's any chance of punching through the Turkish lines in
the Mediterranean, using a single Italian fleet for support? Cal could keep
the F Ion, threating Greece; you could try to sneak into Wes and get him to
help you into Tunis. Doesn't look very promising, but, your call.
GKJ
Adjustments
Ghost of BirSauron to Cal:
TOLD YOU SO
TOLD YOU SO
TOLD YOU SO
But did you listen????
NO....
How sad but typical....
Edi Birsan
[email protected]
Web: www.mgames.com
Midnight Games
541-772-7872
Sorry folks, busy trying to find a job... :)
Cal
> Diplomacy game 'ghodstoo' is waiting for Italy's orders.
>
> This power will be considered abandoned and free for takeover
> if orders are not received by Fri Nov 7 1997 02:39:28 EST.