| Press for Spring of 1910 in ruffians |
Movement
Broadcast message from Austria in 'ruffians':
Amazing how fast this game is moving with our new Turk! Thanks Meef!
Chris
Message from Germany to Austria in 'ruffians':
> >
> > Message from [email protected] as Austria to Germany in 'ruffians':
> >
> > Paul,
> >
> > Whew!
> >
> > I was worried you'd get a little nervous, but I can see that you viewed
> > russia the same way I did -- helpful, but a pain in the back given a little
> > growth.
> >
> > Ok, let's see -- Christian retreated to Portugal, did you note that?
> >
>
> Yes--not a minute after I predicted that he'd retreat to Mao.
>
> >
> > <<. In fact, I can afford to convoy my A
> > Den-
> > Lvn next Spring to help you out on the Russian front!>>
> >
> > That sounds great.
> >
> > <<I want to build a F Kie, and move it to Den to give me a third fleet on
> > the
> > Nth.>>
> >
> > Sounds good to me. Christian is going to have a bitch kitty of a time
> > holding what hes got now.
> >
> > <<Perhaps A Pic-Par, A Bel-Pic, F Hol-Bel supported by Ruhr, and A Mar-Gas
> > supported by Spain.... This would leave A Spain vulnerable, but it would
> > certainly
> > ensure that I would regain/keep Brest!>>
> >
> > Maybe Bur S A Mar -> Gas as well as F Naf -> MAO? it could annhialate that
> > Gasconish fleet. Wouldn't that be lovely!
>
> Yeah, unless he moves it to Bre but that's why I'm manouvering 3 units next to
> Bre--
> so that I can retake it in the Fall.
> Can you get France's F Wms to support your F Nth-Mao?
>
> >
> >
> > Spain could get whacked this way if Christian orders Gascony -> Spain
> > supported by Portugal, but that seems a bad move on General Principal.
>
> If A Spain gets annihilated by a "bad" English move, that's okay. I didn't
> really
> expect to get it last turn in the first place! F Gas-Mao is his only logical
> move--
> supported by F Por. That way, he ensures that he keeps Por through the Fall.
> No word yet from Cal....
>
> --Paul
>
> >
> >
> > <<I think that I am more valuable to you as an
> > ally
> > vs. England than I am as a "feeding ground" for your armies. Let Russia
> > serve
> > in
> > THAT capacity!>>
> >
> > i couldn't agree more!
> >
> > My builds are in!
>
> Mine too-- surprise! I built F Kie!
>
> >
> >
> > Chris
Message from Austria to Germany in 'ruffians':
Paul,
Did I read that right? Did Christian keep the army in Finland and disband
the fleet Gulf of Lyon!?!?
Someone explain that to me please?
Does that change your thoughts on how to handle Gascony/Marsailles?
I will write John and ask for his support, but who knows?
its nice to have this game moving again!
Chris
Message from Austria to France in 'ruffians':
John,
Well, Christian was as good as his word, and buh-bye fleet GoL. Thanks! He
wouldn'tve done it if I'da asked! ;)
So, what now? I think my fleet in the Tyhr could be used back Turkey way,
or not. What is your real assesment of Pauls ability to solo?
Chris
By the way, if you want a friend and I are going to a bar called Pageant,
its at 8th and Broadway -- url is:
http://newyork.citysearch.com/E/V/NYCNY/0011/61/62/
We should get there in 45 mins, and will probably be staying til midnight or
so -- swing dancing and good food. so I hear!
Message from Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
Dear Czar Cal,
Our Austrian has made a living in this game lying and stabbing.
Italy was victim 1
I think france was victim 2 season before last
Russia was victim 3 last season
He has attacked Germany already this game.
I will be victim 4 (just a matter of time)
SO how can we maximize the damage against Aus? If we handle this correctly,
we can turn his empire to rubble.
I enjoy long term relationships with Russia when I play Turkey.
I am willing to be a loyal ally with u long term. U being an army power and
I being a fleet power, thus maximizing our comfort level.
Thoughts on how to proceed?
Sultan MiKaL
Message from France to Austria in 'ruffians':
> So, what now? I think my fleet in the Tyhr could be used back Turkey way,
> or not. What is your real assesment of Pauls ability to solo?
he is a MUCH greater threat than anything England could do (just look at
England's position...would anyone capable of solo-ing ever had let that
position deteriorate? I would help England in any way possible while you
position yourself to attack Germany...for right now, IF you attack Geramny
and a tthe same time you and me help England into SPA etc., then in
England's mind you two will be allies and thus he won't see it as a solo,
until you get to about 16. of course if you take the RIGHT 16 then by then
it won't make a difference. That means MUN/BER now, before turkey and Russia
are gone so that you have those key points long before your SC gets much
higher. Also, I would stay 1 SC short of whatever count Germany has until
you stab him, perhaps even play a unit short just to trick the casual
looker-at-maps, which England is.
>
> By the way, if you want a friend and I are going to a bar called Pageant,
> its at 8th and Broadway -- url is:
>
> http://newyork.citysearch.com/E/V/NYCNY/0011/61/62/
>
> We should get there in 45 mins, and will probably be staying til midnight
or
> so -- swing dancing and good food. so I hear!
i'm getting this a little late so I cannot go. however I did go to a
restaurant that has swing music on friday/saturday nights and it was fun
(although i don't know how to dance)
Message from France to Austria in 'ruffians':
I'd also point out that if we can get you into Mar (well maybe I will get
there momentarily but you eventually, then there is an actual play for you
to be in Spain. Although you may not be able to hold it long if they were
working against you, it means that you need Austria+Italy+Balkans = 10 + WAR
+ Turkey + SEV = 15. Now add in Tunis + Mar + Spa, while pressuring MUN/BER
and you get to 18+ easily. (i harbour no expectations that I will survive,
however it amuses me to help out because of who is playing Germany...of
course if you find a 19th, then I expect you to let me survive as a matter
of 'honor amoung thieves')
I am moving to GOL this spring, so maybe we can do something against Germany
in Marseilles in the fall. At the least I'd move A PIE-MAR just to make sure
that England gets Spain and that the army there gets destroyed. You can thus
cost Germany 2 SC this year with the use of but one unit (A PIE) leaving A
BUR free to make trouble in Paris and Munich as a diversion.
Message from France to England in 'ruffians':
England,
I am sure that Austria would be willing to move to MAR to cut its support
thuis giving you a free attack on Spain, which will DESTROY the German army
there. That means that I would be able to take Marseilles in the fall, a net
loss to Germany of -2. To guarantee taking Spain you will have to move F
GAS - SPA (nc), otherwise Germany can stymie your attack easily by doing A
MAR-GAS. Once you do that you can re-arrange the units in the fall and take
BRE the next year. For now I think you should protect North Sea as long as
possible until you can build that new unit you get from getting Spain back,
which means F ENG-NTH with Norway's support and supporting SWE to hold.
Status quo actually helps you in the North since Germany will likely lose
2-3 units this year, depending on Russia's moves
Message from Russia to Turkey in 'ruffians':
> Message from [email protected] as Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
> Dear Czar Cal,
> Our Austrian has made a living in this game lying and stabbing.
Boy, you picked up on that quick! d;-})
> Italy was victim 1
> I think france was victim 2 season before last
> Russia was victim 3 last season
> He has attacked Germany already this game.
>
> I will be victim 4 (just a matter of time)
Quite honestly, this is so evident, it makes me wonder why he stabbed me.
If him and I had eliminated you, we could have turned to face the west and
probably handled them easily. This way, once *I* am gone, he has you behind
him with fleets. My mind just boggles at what he was thinking. Oh well,
mine is not to reason why, mine is but to make the S.O.B. pay for it! <G>
> SO how can we maximize the damage against Aus? If we handle this
correctly,
> we can turn his empire to rubble.
I think we can benefit immediately, although you should play along as if
you're his willing little toady. Any info we can get on his tactics will go
a long way.
I need my armies in Stp, Lvn & Ukr to make sure I get War back in the Fall,
so if you can support me in Rumania in the Spring, I will support you into
Bulgaria in the Fall. We have to start beating him back as soon as possible
to stop the momentum.
> I enjoy long term relationships with Russia when I play Turkey.
Someone who believes in ANY kind of alliance play will be a novelty in the
game. I freely admit that I'm a believer in "enlightened self-interest",
but I also remember reading the part about having to ally with someone at
some point to prosper. If we start to do real good and roll across the
board, I'll stab you if you give me an opening, but I won't do it when it's
not in my best interests and I certainly don't switch allies just for a
change which I feel Chris just did.
> I am willing to be a loyal ally with u long term. U being an army power
and
> I being a fleet power, thus maximizing our comfort level.
That sounds like a sensible plan given the rest of the board's tendency to
chaos.
> Thoughts on how to proceed?
As above. Let's cut his momentum and then cave him in at the corners.
Regards,
Cal
Message from England to France in
'ruffians':
Hi!
I was actually thinking of giving you Spain, as that would perhaps tempt you more and thus making it more probable that you actuall follow up the ide
a. Anyway, you suggest me moving Gas-Spa while you move Wes-Lyo? If you capture Spain on the other hand we can sit there forever and guard the Gibral
tar together...OK, I'll ask Austria about cutting Marseilles.
/Christian
Message from England to Germany in
'ruffians':
Paul,
It looks like Chris will stab you now. The new Turk is on his side and they will soon erradicate Russia oven though I let him recapture StP. I was th
inking that maybe you and me can start working together again?
/Christian
Message from England to Austria in
'ruffians':
Chris,
Are you willing to stab Germany now? Are you willing to DMZ the Med for a while? I suggest you capture Tunis with NAf and help me into Spain and Fran
ce into Marseiles while you move to capture Mun and possibly more. Let me know what you think!
/Christian
Message from Germany to England in 'ruffians':
> >
> > Message from [email protected] as England to Germany in
> > 'ruffians':
> >
> > Paul,
> > It looks like Chris will stab you now. The new Turk is on his side and they will soon erradicate Russia oven though I let him recapture StP. I wa
s th
> > inking that maybe you and me can start working together again?
> >
>
> Christian:
> I will never refuse to even listen to someone, but your credibility suffers by
> your choice of removals. Why did you pull your F Gol, leaving the entire Med open to Austria? Wouldn't A Fin have been a better removal, in view
of
> your loss
> of StP?
> I assume that your Fall move of F Mao-Gas was meant simply to cut my support
> for Bre, or to block an attack on Spain? How could Bre or Spa have been worth
> the loss of Mao? That goes double for next gameyear!
>
> --Paul
Message from Germany to Austria in 'ruffians':
>
> >
> > Message from [email protected] as Austria to Germany in 'ruffians':
> >
> > Paul,
> >
> > Did I read that right? Did Christian keep the army in Finland and disband
> > the fleet Gulf of Lyon!?!?
> >
> > Someone explain that to me please?
>
> It is beyond my understanding. A Fin can help support Swe, sure, while F
> Nwy
> is used to help in covering Nth. But was it worth abandoning the Med? Is he
> going
> to leave Mao to you too?
>
> >
> >
> > Does that change your thoughts on how to handle Gascony/Marsailles?
>
> Not really. I figure that he still has to make a supported move back to Mao, so
> I
> honestly do not expect to lose Spa. Will he try F Eng-Bre? Again, I doubt it
> as he
> needs two fleets just to hold Nth. Let's go for Gascony, Par and Pic; I can
> always
> take Bre back in the Fall!
> If you take Mar and Mao, you can support me to Por in the Fall while your
> A Mar takes Spain; it will simply make the final conquest of Iberia that much
> easier. If you don't take Mao, your A Mar might support my A Spa in holding;
> perhaps you can support me to Mos in compensation?
>
> >
> >
> > I will write John and ask for his support, but who knows?
>
> Are you sure that you want to let that genie out of the bottle? You should be
> able
> to contain the Sultan while concentrating upon the Russian war....
>
> --Paul
>
> >
> >
> > its nice to have this game moving again!
> >
> > Chris
Message from Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
How about this idea:
I need a build really badly as u know. I think we need to take bul back
before he gets his army in tri to ser. So
a arm - bla - bul
f bla c arm - bul
f con s arm - bul
a rum s arm - bul
a sev s rum
I think we will destroy his a bul this way.
thoughts?
Message from Turkey to Austria in 'ruffians':
CHris,
What next?. Thanks for removing f aeg to gre. Your plan worked well,
Russia is on the ropes. I really need a build, I would like to gain bul
this next season. THoughts?
Meef
Message from Russia to Turkey in 'ruffians':
> Message from [email protected] as Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
>
> How about this idea:
>
> I need a build really badly as u know. I think we need to take bul back
> before he gets his army in tri to ser. So
> a arm - bla - bul
> f bla c arm - bul
> f con s arm - bul
>
> a rum s arm - bul
> a sev s rum
>
> I think we will destroy his a bul this way.
>
> thoughts?
I agree that getting you a build is priority one. The thing that worries me
is losing Rumania to a combined Ser/Bud attack. Hmmm, well, the most likely
moves for him are:
A Bud-Rum,
S by A Bul
F Gre s A Bul
A Tri-Ser
With your plan, we get a standoff, but I don't lose Rum. Of course, that
means Serbia has a chance to move into position. Your plan probably gives a
shot at really cutting his momentum if not putting him back on the
defensive.
Okay, I'm willing to do it your way.
There is, however, something riskier that guarantees results. How about
this:
Russia:
A Rum-Bul
Turkey
F Bla & F Con s A Rum-Bul
This guarantees that we take Bulgaria and in the Fall we put everything we
have into getting your army into Rumania. This is obviously riskier and
puts our alliance to the test right away. It does give good results.
I know that's a tough thing to ask on our first move together, but it's the
last thing he'll be expecting. If you prefer to be cautious, we'll do it
your way, but would you at least consider the more radical plan? If you
don't, then no hard feelings and we play on against Austria.
What do you think?
Cal
Message from France to England in 'ruffians':
> I was actually thinking of giving you Spain, as that would perhaps tempt
you more and thus making it more probable that you actuall follow up the ide
> a. Anyway, you suggest me moving Gas-Spa while you move Wes-Lyo? If you
capture Spain on the other hand we can sit there forever and guard the
Gibral
> tar together...OK, I'll ask Austria about cutting Marseilles.
I entirely agree that it would be a lot better for me and for defense
against ANYONE's solo that you and I bottle up the MAO. However, with 4
German fleets in play I think it is vitally important that we cause him some
disbands (and you some builds) THIS turn. This way we maximize the
effectiveness of our combined 3 units and just as important we don't risk
Germany making a lucky guess in defending Spain. We can always re-arrange
the Iberian situation later since Austria is not in a naval position. IF we
don't do something about Germany this year then he can force himself into
North Sea next year and then we've got real problems. My thinking is that we
get Germany under control, and then if Austria gets *too* big we back off
Germany. This means the key points will remain STP, MUN, MAR, SPA, and TUN,
3 of which you and I are in a position to gravely effect.
If you think the position would be better with me in Spain (SOUTH COAST)
rather than you in spain (NORTH COAST) then you do have a good point, and we
can handle it that way. It will also mean that one of your fleets (F GAS) is
free to bother Brest in the fall. Just let me know somewhat fast so I can
submit different orders.
-France
Message from Austria to Turkey in 'ruffians':
Meef,
Next we really kick Russia hard. This year coming should net you 2 builds,
Bulgaria and Sevastopol.
The moves are these:
Me:
A Warsaw -> Ukraine (1)
A Vienna -> Galicia (2)
A Budapest S A Bul -> Rumania
A Bulgaria -> Rumania (3)
A Trieste -> Serbia (2)
You:
F Con -> Bul (ec) (4)
F Black S A Armenia -> Sev
A Armenia -> Sev (3)
(1) Cuts support for Both Sev and Rum.
(2) eliminates retreat options, ensuring the annhialation of A Rum
(3) Guaranteed to succeed!
(4) allows me to move F Greece -> Ionian without fear.
I am still in good position to wheel about and nail Germany, and you are
back to 5 centers!
I have played with several scenarios in the last 10 minutes or so, and this
looks to be the best combo. did I miss anything? Let me know.
Chris
Message from England to Germany in
'ruffians':
Paul,
I could not leave NTH open for you to take. I need to be able to keep Swe
and NTH to work with you, otherwise you would just continue to attack me
while I was disbanding more and more defence. I will disband anti-German
if Germany attacks me.
If you have some interesting plan to suggest I would very much like to
work with you, but as I see it it is you who must want to work with me, I
will move defensively until I see you turning. Show me your good will and
we can work good together in a couple of turns.'
/Christian
Message from England to France in
'ruffians':
I cannot really decide what way is best, now that you have convinced me
with a lot of argument for me getting Spa. Okey, I will move as you first
suggested: Gas-Spa, Por S Gas-Spa.
/Christian
Message from Austria to Germany in 'ruffians':
> > Does that change your thoughts on how to handle Gascony/Marsailles?
>
> Not really. I figure that he still has to make a supported move back to
Mao, so
> I
> honestly do not expect to lose Spa. Will he try F Eng-Bre? Again, I
doubt it
> as he
> needs two fleets just to hold Nth. Let's go for Gascony, Par and Pic; I
can
> always
> take Bre back in the Fall!
Ok, sounds good.
A Pie -> Mar
A Bur S A Mar -> Gas
F Naf -> MAO
I am trying to find out what france will do. Do you two have a history
beyond this game? He got pretty vicious when you stabbed him. (As we say
in New Yawk City, however "Scoreboard! Scoreboard! Germany 10 France 1!
Who made the mistake? ;)
<<> Are you sure that you want to let that genie out of the bottle? You
should be
> able
> to contain the Sultan while concentrating upon the Russian war....>>
That is the question. I am running scenarios now, as it were. Clearly with
you and me and some turkish Help weI can take Russia out in 2 years, tops.
But is the speed worth a 5 center Turkey? I think not. So Cal may be a tad
harder to crack.
I'm woriking the wires, and I'll see if I can get any intel on what
Christian intends to do.
Best,
Chris
Message from Austria to England in 'ruffians':
Christian
It's definitely time Germany took a hit. Thanks for Disbanding in Gulf of
Lyon, that was a big help to me.
I will hit Marsailles, cutting support for Spain. Do you think Paul would
move Marsailles -> Gascony, to cut support or to get closer to Brest? I
think he might go Mar -> Gas and Spain -> Mar, as well as some cut of
support on Burgundy just to keep me honest.
A DMZ in the Med/Atlantic area sounds great to me I stay out of Naf/Westmed,
you stay out of Spain (SC) and the MAO, that sort of thing -- let me know
how you want to play it. We are better off fighting Germany than each
other.
Best,
Chris
Message from Germany to Austria in 'ruffians':
> I am trying to find out what france will do. Do you two have a history
> beyond this game? He got pretty vicious when you stabbed him. (As we say
> in New Yawk City, however "Scoreboard! Scoreboard! Germany 10 France 1!
> Who made the mistake? ;)
I was a bit puzzled by the vehemence of John's reaction to my stab: perhaps my
goading him in the broadcast press didn't improve his attitude any, but he
definitely
overreacted. I was given no choice but to follow through with the attack.
Evidently John and I have been in one other game before, but that encounter has
faded from even the most distant recesses of my mind. (I've been in too many
games?)
As things stand, I won't interfere with the negociations between A/F. He
doesn't
seem to be pestering me right now, so why should I get him started all over
again?
>
>
>
>
> I'm woriking the wires, and I'll see if I can get any intel on what
> Christian intends to do.
He's been after me to change sides again. I asked him for a "credible plan" and
he
replied: "Show me evidence of your good faith and I will show you a pretty good
plan." Yeah, right.... He threatens to keep "making anti-German removals",
but
thus far I haven't even seen much sign of THAT: how did his yanking F Gol hurt
ME?
He says that keeping me out of Nth is his top priority, but he doesn't have
enough
fleets to stop me from getting there with three navies this Fall. Surely he
must know this?
Paul
>
>
Message from Austria to France in 'ruffians':
John,
Paul has invited me into Marsailles.
!
I guess he doesn't see me as any kind of a threat.
!
What do you think about supporting me to MAO this turn, and I try to put you
in Spain in the fall?
Chris
Message from France to Austria in 'ruffians':
>
> Paul has invited me into Marsailles.
why not? he can't stop you from taking it this year anyway--might as well
get brownie points for "offering" it to you
> What do you think about supporting me to MAO this turn, and I try to put
you
> in Spain in the fall?
I think that plants a big fat target on Austria's head as a threat to solo.
I think you should greatfully accept the offer of MAR and then support me
into it in the fall. A fleet in MAR will look very safe to both G and E and
look like it is bottling you up...when the time is right you will have built
up the fleet(s) you need to enter MAO. The best way right now to drive
England back into Germany's arms is for there to be a Austrian fleet in MAO,
esp since you don't have the other 3 fleets to back up such a foray. I would
concentrate on taking the border centers needed for a win, and then swooping
back to collect the rear line centers (in Turkey and south russia) etc.
Message from Austria to Germany in 'ruffians':
<<He threatens to keep "making anti-German removals",
but
thus far I haven't even seen much sign of THAT: how did his yanking F Gol
hurt
ME?
He says that keeping me out of Nth is his top priority, but he doesn't
have
enough
fleets to stop me from getting there with three navies this Fall. Surely he
must know this?>>
Hmmm. Norway -> North Supported by EngChan, fin -> Swe, Swe -> Skag?
That gives him the third fleet to defend with. Of course, he can't hold
Both Sweden AND the North Sea. ;)
I think GoL's removal was more pro-me than anti-you. He is trying to get me
to attack you as well. Golly, fostering dissent between allies, what will
he come up with next?
Chris
Message from Austria to France in 'ruffians':
<<
why not? he can't stop you from taking it this year anyway--might as well
get brownie points for "offering" it to you>>
Hmmmm. hadn't looked at it that way.
<<> What do you think about supporting me to MAO this turn, and I try to put
you
> in Spain in the fall?
I think that plants a big fat target on Austria's head as a threat to solo.
I think you should greatfully accept the offer of MAR and then support me
into it in the fall. A fleet in MAR will look very safe to both G and E and
look like it is bottling you up...when the time is right you will have built
up the fleet(s) you need to enter MAO. The best way right now to drive
England back into Germany's arms is for there to be a Austrian fleet in MAO,
esp since you don't have the other 3 fleets to back up such a foray. I would
concentrate on taking the border centers needed for a win, and then swooping
back to collect the rear line centers (in Turkey and south russia) etc.>>
Hhhhhhhhhhh. You are probably right. Its like when Germany said "since
you're moving out of Munich, why don't you move to the Ruhr and help me
against England?" Getting that first unit across the stalemate line is the
hardest one. The thing about a fleet in the atlantic, even a solo fleet, is
that they just don't have the force to pin it down. But you are of course
right. I hate to leave such a nice posting though. You're moving to GoL,
I'll move Naf -> Westmed, and send that Tyrh fleet back to Ionian to set up
those Turkish centers.
Are you promising Christian you'll support him to Spain in the Spring? I
think he thinks you are.
Sigh. Pinky, we'll have to put off the world domination until tommorow
night.
Chris
Message from Germany to Austria in 'ruffians':
Chris;
>
> Hmmm. Norway -> North Supported by EngChan, fin -> Swe, Swe -> Skag?
>
> That gives him the third fleet to defend with. Of course, he can't hold
> Both Sweden AND the North Sea. ;)
And ANY future English removal will be pro-German. He's running out of units!
>
>
> I think GoL's removal was more pro-me than anti-you. He is trying to get me
> to attack you as well. Golly, fostering dissent between allies, what will
> he come up with next?
>
Actually, one reason that I'm "inviting you" into Mar is to diffuse the allure
of
English siren songs. I'm not doing it for free, inasmuch as I'll be asking for
support
to somewhere else, but I want to make his offers less attractive at the same
time!
Paul
Message from Austria to Germany in 'ruffians':
<<
Actually, one reason that I'm "inviting you" into Mar is to diffuse the
allure
of
English siren songs. I'm not doing it for free, inasmuch as I'll be asking
for
support
to somewhere else, but I want to make his offers less attractive at the same
time!>>
Ok, that makes sense. I did wonder. I think Moscow looks likely as a
replacement center though.
Chris
Message from Austria to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal,
Ok, you've had a night to think on it. I am prepared to start the German
Campaign, return Warsaw to you, and finish Turkey off. My security vs. you
is ensured, and I have no further ambitions in Russia. Keep Rum, build a
fleet in StPete, and we can take up where we left off.
Hmm?
Chris
Message from France to Austria in 'ruffians':
> Are you promising Christian you'll support him to Spain in the Spring? I
> think he thinks you are.
I didn't have that sense at all. I did suggest that you would move A PIE-MAR
to cut its support thereby telling England that if he moves F GAS-SPA (NORTH
COAST!) that the move would then succeed no matter what. Now, this does
tthree things:
1) leaves me free to move to GOL which is more useful for you and me
2) prevents England from making any moves into the Med since then he is in
north coast
3) guarantees the desctruction of Germany army in Spain, which means Germany
loses SPA *and* MAR this year. Under all circumstances, that is good news
for you no matter who gets what
England had originally suggest to support me into Spain, which is silly
since then he kicks me out in the fall and stops me from helping you take
Marseilles. With him in Spain in north coast, you can help me into MAR, make
yourself not look like a threat and buy the several season you need to get
those Turkish centers and get the resulting builds to the front. I think by
the time E or G really sees how many SC you can pick up quickly it will be
too late.
p.s. did you realize that you can take Munich this year very easily? His
only defense means leaving PAR *and* BEL open which seems silly since you
haven't "threatened" Germany yet with armies int he border regions. If you
move to BOH or TYR and move retain A BUR then he *must* move A RUH-MUN and A
BEL-RUH to protect MUN. (in fact, you might consider moving A BUR-RUH which
effectively isolates his army and locks Munich for the fall (who cares if
he sees it coming at that point.) COmbined with loss of Spain, Marseilles
this means -3 for Germany. Suddenly you don't even NEED Moscow or Sevastapol
to get to 18!
Message from Russia to Austria in 'ruffians':
>Message from [email protected] as Austria to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
>Ok, you've had a night to think on it. I am prepared to start the German
>Campaign, return Warsaw to you, and finish Turkey off. My security vs. you
>is ensured, and I have no further ambitions in Russia. Keep Rum, build a
>fleet in StPete, and we can take up where we left off.
>
>Hmm?
I figured I better answer before you get nervous again... <g>
I'm willing to try this as I STILL think it makes the most sense, but I'm
going to play this turn as if I think you're going to try to defend Warsaw.
If you make the moves you say, we'll have something to talk about. If not,
well... we continue on.
Fair enuff?
Cal
Message from Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal, below is a copy of Austria's latest message.
"Meef,
Next we really kick Russia hard. This year coming should net you 2 builds,
Bulgaria and Sevastopol.
The moves are these:
Me:
A Warsaw -> Ukraine (1)
A Vienna -> Galicia (2)
A Budapest S A Bul -> Rumania
A Bulgaria -> Rumania (3)
A Trieste -> Serbia (2)
You:
F Con -> Bul (ec) (4)
F Black S A Armenia -> Sev
A Armenia -> Sev (3)
(1) Cuts support for Both Sev and Rum.
(2) eliminates retreat options, ensuring the annhialation of A Rum
(3) Guaranteed to succeed!
(4) allows me to move F Greece -> Ionian without fear.
I am still in good position to wheel about and nail Germany, and you are
back to 5 centers!
I have played with several scenarios in the last 10 minutes or so, and this
looks to be the best combo. did I miss anything? Let me know.
Chris"
I am thinking:
a rum h
a sev s rum
(bounces his attack on rum)
a ukr - gal
(bounces a vie - gal and a war - ukr)
a stp - mos
a arm - bla - bul
f bla c arm - bul
f con s arm - bul
(a bul will retreat to gre)
in the fall u can retake war
i will try and get out into aeg
in the winter i will build another fleet in smy and force my way out toward
gre, etc
u can build another army and .... the pressure builds
thoughts?
Meef
Message from Russia to Turkey in 'ruffians':
I'm at work now and will respond when I get home tonight. Without looking
at a board, your moves sound okay. FWIW, Austria wrote to me and asked if
we could return to being allies. Uh huh, sure...
Later,
Cal
>Message from [email protected] as Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
>
>Cal, below is a copy of Austria's latest message.
>
>"Meef,
>Next we really kick Russia hard. This year coming should net you 2 builds,
>Bulgaria and Sevastopol.
>The moves are these:
>Me:
>A Warsaw -> Ukraine (1)
>A Vienna -> Galicia (2)
>A Budapest S A Bul -> Rumania
>A Bulgaria -> Rumania (3)
>A Trieste -> Serbia (2)
>You:
>F Con -> Bul (ec) (4)
>F Black S A Armenia -> Sev
>A Armenia -> Sev (3)
>(1) Cuts support for Both Sev and Rum.
>(2) eliminates retreat options, ensuring the annhialation of A Rum
>(3) Guaranteed to succeed!
>(4) allows me to move F Greece -> Ionian without fear.
>I am still in good position to wheel about and nail Germany, and you are
>back to 5 centers!
>I have played with several scenarios in the last 10 minutes or so, and this
>looks to be the best combo. did I miss anything? Let me know.
>Chris"
>
> I am thinking:
>a rum h
>a sev s rum
>(bounces his attack on rum)
>a ukr - gal
>(bounces a vie - gal and a war - ukr)
>a stp - mos
>
>a arm - bla - bul
>f bla c arm - bul
>f con s arm - bul
>(a bul will retreat to gre)
>
>in the fall u can retake war
>i will try and get out into aeg
>
>in the winter i will build another fleet in smy and force my way out toward
>gre, etc
>u can build another army and .... the pressure builds
>
>thoughts?
>
>Meef
>
>
Message from Russia to Turkey in 'ruffians':
Okay, Meef, I've looked at your suggestions and I like them. The only
change I'll make is that A Rum may as well support the move to Bulgaria by A
Arm. Make sense?
Cal
PS: And just FYI, here's the latest from Austria to ME:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------
Message from Austria to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal,
Ok, you've had a night to think on it. I am prepared to start the German
Campaign, return Warsaw to you, and finish Turkey off. My security vs. you
is ensured, and I have no further ambitions in Russia. Keep Rum, build a
fleet in StPete, and we can take up where we left off.
Hmm?
Chris
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------
>Message from [email protected] as Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
>
>Cal, below is a copy of Austria's latest message.
>
>"Meef,
>Next we really kick Russia hard. This year coming should net you 2 builds,
>Bulgaria and Sevastopol.
>The moves are these:
>Me:
>A Warsaw -> Ukraine (1)
>A Vienna -> Galicia (2)
>A Budapest S A Bul -> Rumania
>A Bulgaria -> Rumania (3)
>A Trieste -> Serbia (2)
>You:
>F Con -> Bul (ec) (4)
>F Black S A Armenia -> Sev
>A Armenia -> Sev (3)
>(1) Cuts support for Both Sev and Rum.
>(2) eliminates retreat options, ensuring the annhialation of A Rum
>(3) Guaranteed to succeed!
>(4) allows me to move F Greece -> Ionian without fear.
>I am still in good position to wheel about and nail Germany, and you are
>back to 5 centers!
>I have played with several scenarios in the last 10 minutes or so, and this
>looks to be the best combo. did I miss anything? Let me know.
>Chris"
>
> I am thinking:
>a rum h
>a sev s rum
>(bounces his attack on rum)
>a ukr - gal
>(bounces a vie - gal and a war - ukr)
>a stp - mos
>
>a arm - bla - bul
>f bla c arm - bul
>f con s arm - bul
>(a bul will retreat to gre)
>
>in the fall u can retake war
>i will try and get out into aeg
>
>in the winter i will build another fleet in smy and force my way out toward
>gre, etc
>u can build another army and .... the pressure builds
>
>thoughts?
>
>Meef
Message from Austria to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal,
Nice to see you have your sense of humor about you on RGD! :)
Ok, here's the skinny:
I have told turkey the following, and haven't heard from him since, but I
think maybe he only accesses at work?
Me:
A War -> Ukr
A Vie -> Gal
A Bud s A Bul -> Rum
A Bul -> Rum
A Tri -> Ser
Him:
A Arm -> Sev
F Black S A Arm -> Sev
F Con -> Bul
Ok, no big surprises there, tis the optimum set of moves given the position,
right? So, question for you -- can you see a set of moves, which preserves
Turkeys moves, AND gives you and I the opportunity to take back BOTH Sev and
Bulgaria in the fall, as well as take one of Turkey's home SC;s, with F
Greece -> Aeg -> Smy. I am trying to work it out, and I'm SURE we can do
it, but only if we co-ordinate.
I have to say again, that I stabbed you because I felt that your position in
the Balkans was really approaching an overwhelming nature. Iprobably should
have simply expressed that concern, but I didn't feel I could ask you to
simply Cede a center to me to make me happy, and with the mis-orders that
happened when you went into the hospital, I wasn't sure how to handle
things.
Clearly, you are a better ally than Turkey. Aside from being able to play a
long term plan, You have expansion opps that don't include Me! I wonder
when/if Meef is going to bring that up . . .
All the best,
Chris
Message from Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal,
my moves as issued:
a arm - bla - bul
f bla c arm - bul
f con s arm - bul
Mr. Austria is a pretty treacherous fellow, eh?
Meef
Message from Turkey to Austria in 'ruffians':
> Meef,
>
> Next we really kick Russia hard. This year coming should net you 2
builds,
> Bulgaria and Sevastopol.
>
> The moves are these:
>
> Me:
>
> A Warsaw -> Ukraine (1)
> A Vienna -> Galicia (2)
> A Budapest S A Bul -> Rumania
> A Bulgaria -> Rumania (3)
> A Trieste -> Serbia (2)
>
> You:
>
> F Con -> Bul (ec) (4)
> F Black S A Armenia -> Sev
> A Armenia -> Sev (3)
>
> (1) Cuts support for Both Sev and Rum.
> (2) eliminates retreat options, ensuring the annhialation of A Rum
> (3) Guaranteed to succeed!
> (4) allows me to move F Greece -> Ionian without fear.
>
> I am still in good position to wheel about and nail Germany, and you are
> back to 5 centers!
>
> I have played with several scenarios in the last 10 minutes or so, and
this
> looks to be the best combo. did I miss anything? Let me know.
>
> Chris
Looks like a GREAT plan, will be fun after Russia is gone, he he.
My moves as issued:
F con - bul (ec)
F bla s a arm - sev
A arm - sev
Meef
Message from Russia to Turkey in 'ruffians':
> Message from [email protected] as Turkey to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
> Cal,
>
> my moves as issued:
> a arm - bla - bul
> f bla c arm - bul
> f con s arm - bul
>
> Mr. Austria is a pretty treacherous fellow, eh?
Yep. Especially considering that he just sent me a copy of the exact same
moves he proposed to you. He wants me to figure out a set of moves that
will frustrate yours exactly.
Can you say "Playing one side against the other"?
I've already submitted the moves I said I would as well as the support for
your convoy to Bul.
Cal
Message from Russia to Austria in 'ruffians':
> Message from [email protected] as Austria to Russia in
'ruffians':
>
> Nice to see you have your sense of humor about you on RGD! :)
I only ever lose that temporarily such as when I am viciously and uselesly
stabbed... d;-})
> Ok, here's the skinny:
>
> I have told turkey the following, and haven't heard from him since, but I
> think maybe he only accesses at work?
Dunno. He hasn't written me since the initial contact.
> Me:
>
> A War -> Ukr
> A Vie -> Gal
> A Bud s A Bul -> Rum
> A Bul -> Rum
> A Tri -> Ser
>
> Him:
>
> A Arm -> Sev
> F Black S A Arm -> Sev
> F Con -> Bul
>
> Ok, no big surprises there, tis the optimum set of moves given the
position,
> right? So, question for you -- can you see a set of moves, which
preserves
> Turkeys moves, AND gives you and I the opportunity to take back BOTH Sev
and
> Bulgaria in the fall, as well as take one of Turkey's home SC;s, with F
> Greece -> Aeg -> Smy. I am trying to work it out, and I'm SURE we can do
> it, but only if we co-ordinate.
I'm glad you're sure. I can't see any way to avoid one of my armies being
snuffed unless you don't move as said. I suppose I could retreat Sev-Mos,
but that still leaves Rum going bye-bye. Suggestions?
<<Several portions where Chris breaks the Academy's rules snipped...>>
Later,
Cal
Message from Russia to Turkey in 'ruffians':
Hi Meef! Thought you might like to say what Austria is saying to me...
Cal
> Message from [email protected] as Austria to Russia in
'ruffians':
>
>
> Cal,
>
> Nice to see you have your sense of humor about you on RGD! :)
>
> Ok, here's the skinny:
>
> I have told turkey the following, and haven't heard from him since, but I
> think maybe he only accesses at work?
>
> Me:
>
> A War -> Ukr
> A Vie -> Gal
> A Bud s A Bul -> Rum
> A Bul -> Rum
> A Tri -> Ser
>
> Him:
>
> A Arm -> Sev
> F Black S A Arm -> Sev
> F Con -> Bul
>
> Ok, no big surprises there, tis the optimum set of moves given the
position,
> right? So, question for you -- can you see a set of moves, which
preserves
> Turkeys moves, AND gives you and I the opportunity to take back BOTH Sev
and
> Bulgaria in the fall, as well as take one of Turkey's home SC;s, with F
> Greece -> Aeg -> Smy. I am trying to work it out, and I'm SURE we can do
> it, but only if we co-ordinate.
>
> I have to say again, that I stabbed you because I felt that your position
in
> the Balkans was really approaching an overwhelming nature. Iprobably
should
> have simply expressed that concern, but I didn't feel I could ask you to
> simply Cede a center to me to make me happy, and with the mis-orders that
> happened when you went into the hospital, I wasn't sure how to handle
> things.
>
> Clearly, you are a better ally than Turkey. Aside from being able to play
a
> long term plan, You have expansion opps that don't include Me! I wonder
> when/if Meef is going to bring that up . . .
>
> All the best,
>
> Chris
Message from Austria to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal,
I was just thinking about this as your message came in.
Do you agree that the important thing is that Turkey loses a home SC this
year? to do that we have to allow him some penetration into our turf. I
will modify my moves by NOT taking Rumania, instead I will swing that army
to Greece. His fleet move to Bul will go, leaving me free to convoy that
army to Smyrna in the fall.
You will have three units on Sev in the fall, and should be able to walk
into Warsaw (from Livonia, I assume?) as I walk out. I can tell Mikal I was
worried about him swinging his fleets around, and I will take Rum now, in
the fall. Any luck, he won't see it coming. Even if he does, that army in
Smy is all she wrote for him. I can support Rum to hold in the fall if you
think it's needed as well, since he'll have 3 units there as well.
It's funny how hard Turkey is to take down without that second fleet, isn't
it?
<<Several portions where Chris breaks the Academy's rules snipped...>>
OUCH! I walked into that one with my chin, didn't I?
Best,
chris
Message from Austria to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal,
I was getting ready for work and I was thinking about things some more, and
the more I think about it, the more I feel I need to follow through on the
stab of you, rather than let you up off the mat.
So, in the interests of our personal relationship, I am letting you know
that I am changing horses midstream, and hoping I can ride the tiger long
enough to sooth its savage breast with the music of the night.
To coin a frase.
I love this game, but MAN it stresses me out sometimes!
Chris
Message from Russia to Austria in 'ruffians':
> Message from [email protected] as Austria to Russia in
'ruffians':
>
> I was just thinking about this as your message came in.
>
> Do you agree that the important thing is that Turkey loses a home SC this
> year? to do that we have to allow him some penetration into our turf. I
> will modify my moves by NOT taking Rumania, instead I will swing that army
> to Greece. His fleet move to Bul will go, leaving me free to convoy that
> army to Smyrna in the fall.
Not sure I agree that Turkey losing a home centre per se is paramount. Him
simply not growing is probably more important in my view. Other than that,
your moves sound fine to me.
> You will have three units on Sev in the fall, and should be able to walk
> into Warsaw (from Livonia, I assume?) as I walk out. I can tell Mikal I
was
> worried about him swinging his fleets around, and I will take Rum now, in
> the fall. Any luck, he won't see it coming. Even if he does, that army
in
> Smy is all she wrote for him. I can support Rum to hold in the fall if
you
> think it's needed as well, since he'll have 3 units there as well.
This sounds reasonable to me.
> It's funny how hard Turkey is to take down without that second fleet,
isn't
> it?
Humour is in the eye of the beholder, I guess... d;-})
> <<Several portions where Chris breaks the Academy's rules snipped...>>
>
> OUCH! I walked into that one with my chin, didn't I?
Heh heh.
Cal
signof
Message from Russia to Austria in 'ruffians':
> Message from [email protected] as Austria to Russia in
'ruffians':
>
> I was getting ready for work and I was thinking about things some more,
and
> the more I think about it, the more I feel I need to follow through on the
> stab of you, rather than let you up off the mat.
Don't sweat it. I didn't believe you anyway...
> So, in the interests of our personal relationship, I am letting you know
> that I am changing horses midstream, and hoping I can ride the tiger long
> enough to sooth its savage breast with the music of the night.
You've been listening to too many Christmas carols. d;-})
> To coin a frase.
>
> I love this game, but MAN it stresses me out sometimes!
Ditto.
Later,
Cal
Retreats
Message from Russia to Germany in 'ruffians':
Uh, don't take this wrong, Paul, but it looks to me like you're bending over
backward for Austria and he's reaching for the KY...
If I may presume, here's an analysis of the game from your point of view:
With Austria's help, you've managed to put England on the ropes. That's
good, but to do it, you've had to put yourself so far out of position that
you're will soon become an easy target for Austria. Don't forget, he's
stabbed Italy once, Turkey twice, me once and you once. I don't think he'll
have any qualms about attacking you again. Especially now that he has a
fleet in the Mid and is across the stalemate line.
The only thing that is keeping you safe is the fact that Turkey and I are
offering him resistance. As long as we do, he won't be able to pull units
back from his eastern front. If we go down and he CAN pull those units
back, do you think he'll settle for a two-way draw? Or that you and all
your fleets will be able to stop his armies coming across the German plain?
End of analysis. Do you agree with me about your chances? If you recover a
bit of position to defend against Austrian treachery and let R/T keep him
busy, there's a chance you can win? Or help Chris take me out and guarantee
you that you're the next victim... Comments?
What will it take to get that army out of Livonia? (and NOT into St Pete,
Warsaw or Moscow...)
Cal
Message from Turkey to Austria in 'ruffians':
Dear Archpope,
I am pretty impressed the way you are able to control the affairs of this
game. What reason will u give me for being in the aegean? How is it u can
get France to entrust his final sc to u? How did u get away with your Army
making a pass thru Germany? How is it Germany is willing to turn his back,
knowing the freshly withdrawn stiletto is still in your hand? What do u
have in store for the lowly esteemed newcomer?
MiKaL
Message from England to Austria in
'ruffians':
Chris,
Isn't it time we start work together instead of lying to each other? :)
I can support you to Brest if you want to. Otherwise I suggest you move
back to WES to respect our agreed DMZ. A war between you and me would
have to mean me giving centers to Germany by disbanding to his fortune.
That is not a threat but a promise...*smile*
/Christian
Message from England to France in
'ruffians':
Hi there!
I am not sure whether Austria will let you into MAR but I will sure help
you. Or have you and him agreed to give you Spain?? That would not be
very nice...:( Or do you thing Austria is taking Spain himself from MAR
(agreed with G?)?
Keep in touch!!
/Christian
Message from England to Germany in
'ruffians':
Paul,
Austria is attacking you! If you conquer NTH this turn I will disband in
favour of Austria. I think you I need to work together if we are to stop
Chris from getting 18. He is well past the stalemate in the Med and soon
has reached StP unless you or me support you or Russia to hold it. I will
not support against Austria until I see tha you abort your attack on me.
This season will probably give you one (or two?) disbands. Seeze the
opportunity to disband fleets!!! Austria will eat you up otherwise.
Please? I REALLY wanna work with you. Give me a hint about what I need to
do to get you to start working with me.
/Christian
Message from Germany to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
> Message from [email protected] as Russia to Germany in 'ruffians':
>
> Austria's
> stabbed Italy once, Turkey twice, me once and you once. I don't think he'll
> have any qualms about attacking you again. Especially now that he has a
> fleet in the Mid and is across the stalemate line.
It is rather more England's fault than mine that Austria is advancing so quickly
in
the west, don't you think? Who would have guessed (I didn't) that Christian
would
sacrifice Mao for a petty shot at Spain... a dot that he still might not keep
for a full
gameyear!
To Austria's credit, he hasn't moved more armies into Try and Boh. It
doesn't
look like he's going for anything that he can't simply get by default!
>
>
> The only thing that is keeping you safe is the fact that Turkey and I are
> offering him resistance.
Oh believe me-- I am grateful for little favors!
> If you recover a
> bit of position to defend against Austrian treachery and let R/T keep him
> busy, there's a chance you can win?
>
> What will it take to get that army out of Livonia? (and NOT into St Pete,
> Warsaw or Moscow...)
How are you going to cover both Mos and StP, may I ask? Are you leaving StP for
England to recover?
Why don't you abide by my A Lvn-Stp, knowing that it will be continuing
into
Nwy and allowing you to regain/retain StP? It would at least give you some
measure of security for Mos.
I made the move to Lvn firstly to make room for putting a fleet in Den (to
ensure
my finally regaining Nth); secondly to give myself a chance to regain the dot
I'm
losing in Mar. That's why I'm openly discussing StP here: it would give me the
compensatory dot for the French one, but just until I could advance it further
into
Scandinavia. I WILL pick up Nth Sea this turn, and England will find its home
dots
wide open to my predations. He may well move F Nwy-Nwg, just to cover Edi,
and make my move of A StP-Nwy that much easier.
My estimate is that Austria will refrain from attacking me as long as I'm
making
progress vs. England, while he is increasingly busy with R/T. Assuming that
Chris
will be supporting me back into France, Christian will find himself naked to his
enemies. He may precede R or T into the dumpster! (Oops! Sorry for the brutal
honesty...!)
Paul
Message from Germany to England in 'ruffians':
>
> Message from [email protected] as England to Germany in
> 'ruffians':
>
> Paul,
> Austria is attacking you!
Marginally. He could have walked into Mun, or moved an army to Tyrolia to
make it more convincing, don't you think?
> If you conquer NTH this turn I will disband in
> favour of Austria.
Almost any removal on your part will help me... Spain may be annihilated to
make
this question a nullity, anyway.
> I think you I need to work together if we are to stop
> Chris from getting 18.
> Give me a hint about what I need to do to get you to start working with me.
Well, a little support for A Lvn-StP wouldn't hurt. I need to compensate for
the
loss of Mar. If you pledge to do this, I could make to similar promise to
stay out
of Nth.
I'm curious. Why do you display such vehemence in defending Nth when
you
simply abandoned Mao? Yeah, you annihilated my lone army over there; but can
you even maintain Spain for the Fall season?
Paul
>
>
> /Christian
Message from Russia to Germany in 'ruffians':
>Message from [email protected] as Germany to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
>It is rather more England's fault than mine that Austria is advancing so
>quickly
>in
>the west, don't you think?
Well no, I'd say it's more that Chris is counting on German tunnel vision.
You've got a huge target painted on your back and you're the one who painted
it.
> To Austria's credit, he hasn't moved more armies into Try and Boh.
>It
>doesn't
>look like he's going for anything that he can't simply get by default!
And you're betting your survival on this belief?
> > The only thing that is keeping you safe is the fact that Turkey and I
>are
> > offering him resistance.
>
>Oh believe me-- I am grateful for little favors!
And you seem to have this delusion that you can take me out and NOT have
Chris attack you? Man, what are you thinking? You LIKE digging your own
grave?
>How are you going to cover both Mos and StP, may I ask? Are you leaving
>StP for
>England to recover?
England essentially ceded it back to me. I doubt if he will spare the force
necessary to move there. If he wasn't more worried about you than me, he
wouldn't have given it back to me in the first place.
> Why don't you abide by my A Lvn-Stp, knowing that it will be
>continuing
>into
>Nwy and allowing you to regain/retain StP? It would at least give you some
>measure of security for Mos.
Look Paul, go set the board up and do some math. I'm referring to counting
as in 1-2-3-4. How many centres do you think I HAVE to be ceding you
anything even for a year?
> I made the move to Lvn firstly to make room for putting a fleet in
>Den (to
>ensure
>my finally regaining Nth); secondly to give myself a chance to regain the
>dot
>I'm
>losing in Mar.
Um, have you noticed who's sitting in that centre? Your buddy and master,
Austria.
That's why I'm openly discussing StP here: it would give me the
>
>compensatory dot for the French one, but just until I could advance it
>further
>into
>Scandinavia. I WILL pick up Nth Sea this turn, and England will find its
>home
>dots
>wide open to my predations. He may well move F Nwy-Nwg, just to cover Edi,
>and make my move of A StP-Nwy that much easier.
And you take a centre off me and bring your stab by Austria that much
closer.
> My estimate is that Austria will refrain from attacking me as long as
>I'm
>making
>progress vs. England, while he is increasingly busy with R/T. Assuming
>that
>Chris
>will be supporting me back into France, Christian will find himself naked
>to his
>
>enemies. He may precede R or T into the dumpster! (Oops! Sorry for the
>brutal
>
>honesty...!)
Brutal honesty, I don't mind. It's your brutal delusions that bother me.
You really believe that Chris won't stab you as long as you're making
progress against England? That is utter trash. That's EXACTLY the best
time FOR him to hit you. I was "making progress" against Turkey and he hit
me. And he needs Turkey to be taken out FAR more than he needs England
gone...
Sigh. Doesn't ANYONE in this game think more than a year ahead?
Cal
Message from Germany to Austria in 'ruffians':
Hi Chris!
So England really did swap Mao for Spain: he's trying to convince
me that he
will throw the game to you if I don't pull back on my own attacks on
him.
We can take advantage of your being in Mao: how about your going
with
A Mar-Spa supported by F Wes; F Mao-Por cutting the support there.
Instead of
my sending A Gas-Mar and leaving English A Spa a place to retreat, why
don't we
bounce A Gas and A Bur over Mar? This should be enough to achieve the
annihilation of the English F Spain, and I can keep the dot in Mar for
myself.
How do I compensate for the loss of Spain? Well, StP is wide open,
isn't it?
English A Fin should be busy supporting Swe, while F Nwy should be
engaged in
trying to keep Nth out of my hands. Russia's only means of covering Stp
is to order
Mos there, covering Mos with Ukr-Mos supported by A Sev. Obviously,
this
would mean his abandoning Rum to you so it is by no means a sure thing!
My batting average in guessing the "other guys" moves has been
lousy lately.
What do you think of my guesses this time?
Paul
Message from Germany to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal:
Okay, okay. Might you consider supporting A Lvn-War while I cover
Mun with
Ruhr?
I can't recover Mar unless Austria chooses to give it back (i.e.,
he moves it to
Spain), or supports me to Spa and expects that I'll be grateful and
good.
Maybe I could have the best of both worlds?
Paul
Message from Russia to Germany in 'ruffians':
>Message from [email protected] as Germany to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
> Okay, okay. Might you consider supporting A Lvn-War while I cover
>Mun with
>Ruhr?
> I can't recover Mar unless Austria chooses to give it back (i.e.,
>he moves it to
>Spain), or supports me to Spa and expects that I'll be grateful and
>good.
> Maybe I could have the best of both worlds?
You know, I would actually consider supporting you to Warsaw (keep it out of
Chris' hands, etc) if you could give me one reason to believe that you would
actually move there. Can't see why you would be likely to antagonize
Austria. Keep in mind that I havent asked you to attack him, just leave my
centres alone so *I* can do that.
Cal
Message from Germany to Russia in 'ruffians':
Cal:
> As you say:
> You know, I would actually consider supporting you to Warsaw (keep it out of
> Chris' hands, etc) if you could give me one reason to believe that you would
> actually move there. Can't see why you would be likely to antagonize
> Austria. Keep in mind that I havent asked you to attack him, just leave my
> centres alone so *I* can do that.
Sigh. Everybody says "do this but don't do that." This is getting tiresome.
Look. England says that he won't throw the game to Austria if I stop attacking
him,
but I have to make "positive" moves first. Wowie.
You say "don't take Mos or StP" so I offer to take something else. If I'm
offering
to attack an Austrian dot, is that commitment or what? You can support me from
Mos and still support Mos from Ukr. Giving me someplace to go to besides StP
was the original idea, right? So let's give it a try, and see if that doesn't
dissuade
England from suiciding out. If I can appease R/E without emasculating myself,
that should be the way to go.
Paul
>
>
> Cal
Message from Russia to Germany in 'ruffians':
>Message from [email protected] as Germany to Russia in 'ruffians':
>
>Sigh. Everybody says "do this but don't do that." This is getting
>tiresome.
>
>Look. England says that he won't throw the game to Austria if I stop
>attacking him, but I have to make "positive" moves first. Wowie.
>You say "don't take Mos or StP" so I offer to take something else. If I'm
>offering to attack an Austrian dot, is that commitment or what?
Hey, I agree. Just look at it from my point of view. I'd love to believe
you, but, given how tied to Austria it seems you are, I have to try to
convince myself that you're actually willing to do that. I'm not asking you
to show something "positive", just trying to decide if I'm leaving myself
open or not.
>You can support me from Mos and still support Mos from Ukr. Giving me
>someplace to go to besides StP was the original idea, right? So let's give
>it a try, and see if that doesn't >dissuade England from suiciding out. If
>I can appease R/E without emasculating myself, that should be the way to
>go.
Tell you what. I'll give a tentative "okay" to your plan. I've got to
trust *somebody*. Let me talk to Christian to make sure we can all come to
an accomodation and we'll go ahead with it. You guys will have a tough time
disentangling, but I think we need some kind of stop the leader coalition
before Chris runs away with this thing.
Man, why do I feel like I'm on some windswept cliff trying to hang on with
my teeth?
Cal
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Message from Germany to England in 'ruffians':
Christian:
If I were to move A Lvn-War with Russian support, cover Munich with
Ruhr,
and pledge not to go to Nth Sea, might we have grounds for serious peace
talks?
I've been searching for a way to pull this off without slitting my own
throat.
In the meantime, PLEASE try to hold your own against Austria. Your
giving
Mao to Chris was a major commitment towards cutting off your nose to
spite your
face. There is almost nothing that I can do to help you in keeping
foreign fleets
out of Irish Sea!
Paul
Message from Austria to Russia and Turkey in
'ruffians':
Mikal, Cal
What reason will u give me for being in the aegean? >>
What reason will you give me for not being in Sev? I stabbed a long-time
ally in Russia, and I KNEW he'd be lobbying hard for you to join him against
the big bad austrian. I had to do something to cover the possibility that
you would turn on me. If you hadn't, that fleet could have gone to the
Ionian -- as it is, I'm really glad I left myself a retreat from Bulgaria!
Look, I understand your concerns regarding me. Cal is a good player and can
be quite persuasive. You can see now that if you had moved as I had
suggested, and you agreed, you would now be in Sev AND Bulgaria, Russia
would have been dealt a crushing blow, and I could leave the mopping up to
you while I went after Germany.
Now we are back to the same old stalemate in the Balkans. Will you defend
Bul, or cover Smy? From the tone of your letter Mikal you aren't prepared
to listen to any suggestions I have as to how we could work together, and at
this point I really don't care. I have dealt with THREE backstabbing Turks,
all of whom I tried to work with, and all of whom turned on me. Fine.
Cal, I was a bad boy and I'm sorry. Can you forgive me? You do understand
that this afternoon I was trying to find a way to work with you, but if
Mikal here had stuck to the plan it was too good an opportunity to pass up.
The three of us can stalemate each other for a while, but as I said to you
Germany is now the real threat.
Happy holidays to you both -- Seriously. I wish you both all of the joy of
the season!
Chris
Message from Austria to England in 'ruffians':
<<Isn't it time we start work together instead of lying to each other? :)
I can support you to Brest if you want to.>>
C'mon! Wouldn't it be better to start by NOT lying to me!?! You can't
support me into Brest, you are going to be trying to stop Germany from
getting into the North Sea.'
You are right -- with T/R lining up against me, Germany has to be put on the
slow down. Lets talk about real options. I Didn't want to be in the MAO, I
was trying to set up for an attack on Spain in the fall!
Chris
Message from Austria to France in 'ruffians':
John,
Well, I was looking it over this afternoon, and said to myself, DAMN the
torpedoes, full speed ahead! It Kinda worked, didn't it?
Hhhhhhhhh. Turks. What is it about Turks that they curse my life so?
Ok, I have a thought. How about this;
F GoL S A Burgundy -> Marsailles
A Mars -> Spain
F Mao -> Por
F Westmed S A Mars -> Spain
I am feeling a little out of position in Burgundy -- this takes Germany down
two centers, and he allready had an annhialation. These are actually the
moves Germany has proposed to me, but if you give the "ahem" unwanted
support into Marsaille, then his attempt to bounce Gas -> Mars wont go. I
need another fleet dammit. Turks! Always with me its Turks! ;)
Happy holidays!
Chris